@totoetlititi I don't see a flatpak app for 0.55.2 on the Pd 0.55.2 download page.
You can find "apt-get" versions for Linux/debian etc. here......
https://deb.debian.org/debian/pool/main/p/puredata/
David.

@ddw_music It is a little more complicated.
If you are writing a paper then you should look at @jameslo's conclusions re a previous discussion on the building of the dsp graph and the use of subpatches to control the ordering and ensure repeatability..... https://forum.pdpatchrepo.info/topic/13512/s-r-throw-catch-latency-and-object-creation-order/21
There is a lot of detailed info in the thread.... maybe nothing new for you but...?
David.

@soundproofskin Pd specific shortcut key bindings are in pd_bindings.tcl in the Pd/tcl folder.
You can change them (carefully) to have what you need, or better still write a pd-plugin file.
I don't know (as yet) how to do that correctly.

OS standard bindings seem to be in tk.tcl in the same folder and are set according to the the window system detected.

I am running windows on a Mac so a Mac keyboard. Key identifiers seem to be wrong for some modifying keys.
For me Fn+left and Fn+right jump to the beginning and end of the selected text. But I find no mention of Fn as a modifier anywhere in the .tcl files..... so...?
And the up and down arrows do the same.... jump to the beginning and end.

Sorry... not much help..
David.

@oid A recent change (since the doc was written).
https://puredata.info/docs/developer/PdFileFormat

I don't know how long ago but it doesn't work in Pd extended.
Interesting, and it persists through a save..... so is now part of the file format.
It also works for objects and even some gui's even though gui's have fields already for setting width.
David.

@jameslo Not sure..... if you are banging the slider and moving it at the same time then it is hard to interpret.
The fader can be moved by hand fast enough to cause trouble as the OP found.
Yes, certainly, if moving the slider faster than the speed that would create an output every 0.125 msecs it might not be reliable, but your test is mixing 2 effects so....?
I found that all data points were produced by my test at higher speeds than [metro 0.125] but the console print was failing.
Caveat.... was [tabwrite] still writing to the array?
I will try again at higher rates but if [tabwrite] fails to update the [array] then I will never be certain of the limit without console output.
Except that if a whole 400 point table is written it should indicate success.... unless the screen fails to update because Pd has effectively hung of course.

No idea whether cpu speed has relevance at todays speeds..... probably not.
Mine ... Processor Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-3615QM CPU @ 2.30GHz, 2301 Mhz, 4 Core(s), 8 Logical Processor(s)

David.

@jameslo Comms starts to fail with the console below about [metro 0.125] but all values are still produced by the slider........

David.

@jameslo My test........ as I remember [timer] reporting "The timer object measures elapsed logical time. Logical time moves forward as if all computation were instantaneous and as if all "delay" and "metro" objects were exact."
try.zip
All values are sent by the slider banged at a 1msec rate, and are fast in 0.55.2
Keep the slider sub-patch open or [metro] cannot be stopped.

Much earlier versions of Pd were not so fast, with some values repeated or not sent.
Pd better? Wish86 better than Wish85?.

It looks as though a [metro] fine tuned to the actual reported time could maybe achieve a stable [realtime] value... I will try when I get a moment..
It gives 3 values per 3msecs with jitter.
DSP off.

With DSP on the timings are very stable though and suggest 10 sub-divisions per block.... but none of the maths I have tried so far correlates to samplerate and/or screen refresh.
10 values per 10msecs, so not per block either.

Some thoughts I wrote before actually testing.... which seemed correct at the time of writing but are not confirmed by the control rate test..... so a large pinch of salt required....

"As said above, the intermediate values cannot be recovered, but can be approximated by an audio rate object.
As @jameslo says [lop~] will not arrive at the final value, and introduces a delay (phase shift).... https://forum.pdpatchrepo.info/topic/11850/explanation-for-lop-object-in-this-patch-requested

[line~] and [vline~] will approximate in "realtime" at the samplerate. [vline~] better than [line~] as it works across boundaries and so values between ticks can be obtained.

And anyway, the audio samplerate is 64 values every 1.45msecs.
The control rate samplerate is 1 value every 1.45msecs.
If you drag your number box fast enough then you will exceed even the audio rate possibilities for capture, in much the same way as the values generated by your [osc~] at a high enough frequency.
It is only once back in the analog domain via [dac~] that you can have a smooth waveform.

David.

@PLDS "\" is an escape character....... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Escape_character
Older versions of Pd didn't display them and they could not be typed.
(This forum behaves in a similar manner..... I had to escape the backslash above to make it display)

It says.... what follows... $1 in the message shown in the screenshot below... is a literal string rather than a variable or a special character.

But since some version of Pd (about 0.51) they can be typed, so you can do this......

Which is slightly more elegant... but also much easier......
David.

@cfry You can chain [list split 2]'s.... middle outlet of each to the inlet of the next + left outlets in parallel ..... so as to have longer name/value lists on each line.

And also If you use [route symbol] with just the one argument ( multiple [route symbol] objects in parallel ) it can be updated through the right inlet if necessary.
David.

@cfry Might help...... no-comma.zip
Will remove commas from e.g.
A, 3;
B, 6;
etc.
.... but depends on the lines being always of 2 elements.
[text define] seems to display the data very differently in 0.55 and 0.50.... but results are the same...
David.

@KoaN I have had a bit more luck (as I learn about batch files) creating the two instances.....
https://forum.pdpatchrepo.info/topic/15681/do-different-instances-of-pure-data-run-in-different-threads/5
David.

@jamcultur Batch files....
Tricky.
A path with spaces must be contained within inverted commas ""
Putting inverted commas around the executable name e.g. "pd.exe" opens the installed program and not the one that the path has been set to.

I have finally managed to set flags for each instance....... twice.zip
The second.bat can be included in pd_twice.bat but I am finding it easier to keep them separate for now for testing.

It seems that trying to set midi device numbers in the second instance stymied my previous efforts.

But here that is fixed and working..... pd-twice.zip

Flags here....... http://msp.ucsd.edu/Pd_documentation/resources/chapter3.htm#s3.4.1
..... so each instance could use a different audio or midi device determined in the batch file...
David.

@jamcultur Strange behaviour.
Yes, you can start a second instance. A batch file will do that.....

start "C:\Program Files (x86)\pd\bin\pd.com" start C:\Users\"David"\Desktop\PDMusic\minx\minx_run.pd
start "C:\Program Files (x86)\pd\bin\pd.com" start C:\Users\"David"\Desktop\PDMusic\minx\minx_run.pd
exit

Change the path to your Pd location. Pd.com or Pd.exe shouldn't matter.
The above code will open the same patch twice in different instances. You can open 2 different patches of course.

Windows assigns processes to threads automatically.... different threads I am pretty sure. There might be a way to ensure that but you would need to copy the Pd binary and and rename the copy probably.

A second instance will start with different sockets (Pd<>Wish)so they will be completely separate.
When Pd opens it will have exclusive access to midi and audio pins set in its settings... so the second instance will not get access. You will have to use [netsend] to transfer data between them.

I have tried using command line flags to set each instance to use different devices... no luck so far.
You would have to set audio and midi for the second instance after opening.
David.

For anyone who can help..... the patch is here...... https://forum.pdpatchrepo.info/topic/13555/picodrumz-extremely-simple-drum-module
Personally I think it needs a better ADSR than the simple [line~] but maybe that's a matter of taste.
Changing [the message to line to [1, 0 2000( and the [pow 4] below to about 50 works better for me.
With a syncopated rhythm triggered manually the pitch seems to vary, but I think that's psychoacoustic...
But it could be the [phasor~] fm though as you say...?
Very hard for me to be sure.
David.

@mezko The list-abs library has an abstraction for this... list-inter.zip
It might produce the same lists as @oid's patch. I have not tested.
I imagine that it will do what you are looking for if the correct lists are applied to the second and third intets.
David.

@KoaN Thank you for posting what you have discovered. It will surely help someone in the future.

In windows you can start 2 instances of Pd.... one for audio and one for midi.... which can help as although the audio settings do affect the midi lag you can set one of the instances to run with a tiny buffer that would cause audio dropouts..... but use that instance purely for midi.
This can be done in other os's too.

The 2 instances can then communicate control rate messages using [netsend] and [netreceive].
A steep learning curve but you seem to be advancing rapidly.

The instances can be opened with a pre determined setup using command line flags.... http://msp.ucsd.edu/Pd_documentation/resources/chapter3.htm#s3.4.1

Here is an example of a batch file that should achieve this.....

start "C:\Users\David\Desktop\Pd Vanilla\pd-0.55-2.msw\pd-0.55-2\bin\pd.exe -noaudio -midiindevice 2 -midioutdevice 2" start midi_patch.pd
start "C:\Users\David\Desktop\Pd Vanilla\pd-0.55-2.msw\pd-0.55-2\bin\pd.exe -r 44100 -asio -nomidi -audioindev 9 -audiooutdev 9 -inchannels 18 -outchannels 22 -audiobuf 2 -blocksize 64 -callback -nosleep" start audio_patch.pd
exit

The paths will be wrong for your computer, so will need to be changed, and the command line flags will be wrong for your sound card, and probably for the midi devices too. For the sound card and midi devices you should first open your patch and open the Media AudioSettings and Media MidiSettings and write down the device numbers and settings for those found on your system as Ps starts up.
Then create an audio patch (-nomidi) and a midi patch (-noaudio) and change the command flags to match your setup for each.

BUT I cannot (so far) get the flags to work in a batch file opening 2 instances (works fine for one instance so it is my batch programming problem).
So copy the code above into a simple text editor like notepad, save it as e.g. "pd_twice.bat" and then edit it to match your Pd binary location and the Pd files you want to load to each instance. Once the 2 instances are open set the audio and the midi for the instances to something like this and do not turn on DSP for the midi instance.......
Keep the batch file with the Pd files you are loading in the same folder.

Of course your settings for the audio and the midi instances will be different..... different devices, different delay for audio.... but the midi instance can have the delay set to 1 (or maybe even 0) as it will not be running any audio.
As @jameslo says above...... in Pd the "Delay" setting is the buffer for communication with the sound card.
David.

@KoaN Well done getting it to work... and welcome to the forum.
Pd will introduce a small delay. The "control" messages... the non-audio messages like midi... are processed in between the audio blocks. The standard block in Pd is 64 samples.
That gives a latency of about 1.45 milliseconds. If you move one and a half feet away from another musician you hear what they play one and a half milliseconds later..... so that latency is not really noticeable.
It could be that you have a large audio buffer set for your sound card. On a computer one thing has to finish before another can be processed and audio has priority. Try to keep buffers as small as possible. If you make them too small you will start to get clicks as the computer fails to process audio in time... so it's a compromise.
With a pro soundcard with good drivers you should be able to reduce the buffer to 128 samples or maybe even less. Using the computer on-board sound card you will need a much bigger buffer to avoid clicks and so some noticeable latency.

You are unlikely to get help here with those exact plugins..... as someone would have to have purchased them. But other forums dedicated to plugins might well give you some pointers.
David.

@porres Wow! Thank you to all the contributors..
David.

@Balwyn Personally I wouldn't bother with $0 as the clones and nested clones can have more arguments like this......
this.zip

Edit... I have not passed on an argument for the first clone.... so 20 messages received....obviously incorrect.... but no time to fix it now. But easily doable...

David.

@impression All clones are automatically assigned $1..... normally from 0 but here starting at 1.....
Clone is [clone -s 1 6voices_part 800 800]

Put a [receive] inside the receiving abstraction and [route] your message to the correct abstraction using [route $1]

The message will be e.g. [6 cutoff 0.378(
Where "cutoff 0.378" will be received at the outlet of [route $1] by the abstraction number 6.
Sent to [s curve] (in this case)......
David.