Some of you may have seen this already, but I've been working on a JUCE wrapper around Pure Data. It allows you to use Pure Data inside a DAW, while also providing a smoother GUI experience. There's also a standalone version, if you just want to use the new GUI.

It's based on Camomile (by Pierre Guillot) and includes the ELSE and cyclone libraries (by Alexandre Porres). It uses pd-vanilla 0.52 and should be compatible with most patches pd.

https://github.com/timothyschoen/PlugData

It's currently still in beta testing but should be usable. Let me know if you experience any problems!
Also let me know if anyone is interested in helping out, there's still some work to be done.

v0.4.1 can be downloaded here: https://github.com/timothyschoen/PlugData/releases/tag/v0.4.1

@timothyschoen I know camomile has had some issues loading externals at startup but it would be great to be able to load externals from the standard paths at runtime. have you looked into that possibility at all?

thanks for all of the work

@seb-harmonik.ar I know there are currently some issues with externals, there was a bug report here.

You can add search paths in the settings dialog, I know that it works for abstractions but I still need to test it for externals. I'll make sure it works by the next release!

@timothyschoen cool!
looking at this thread https://forum.pdpatchrepo.info/topic/11242/camomile-v1-0-1-an-audio-plugin-with-pure-data-embedded it seems like the externals themselves may have to be compiled w/ the right defines as well.. (PDINSTANCE and PDTHREAD)..
edit: alternatively, maybe it's worth looking into using single-instance libpd..

@seb-harmonik.ar Thanks for letting me know about this, now I understand the problem! I can't use single-instance for the plugin unfortunately, because you need multi-instance for multiple plugins. I could do it for the standalone, but that will mean that some externals might only be read by the standalone version, and other externals only by the plugin.

@timothyschoen I thought it might be possible to use multiple plugin instances with a single pd instance, and have each plugin instance be a pd abstraction (that can use $0 to refer to patch-specific send and receive names)

that might take some refactoring of the dsp graph (& inlet/outlet) code and storing the canvas pointer in the plugin instance somehow tho..

but, it would also have the advantage of plugin instances being able to communicate w/ each other

@seb-harmonik.ar That might work in some cases, but I think that this will fail if the DAW executes plugins in parallel. Then two threads are accessing the pd patch at the same time, leading to problems.

I might use single instance for the standalone anyway, it would be really nice to offer support for externals.

Nice work! Here's some questions. When you have time, no rush.

The first thing I did was to use it inside Bitwig on Ubuntu 20.04. Both Standalone and VST are working. I tried to Ctrl+1 to create object, but it's "n" for new, ok no problem - but my brain refuse to switch

Tested midi in (the "led" is flashing), neat! Here's one question, how to sync to a DAW (start / stop / BPM)?

I tested the FX~ VST with a very simple patch:
[inlet~]
|
[outlet~]
Doesn't work (no input sound)

All the best!

@EEight

Thanks! You can set up your own keyboard shortcuts in the settings menu, that might help!

Unfortunately there's no way to sync to DAW tempo currently, but I'm planning to add that very soon, as it's obviously needed. Presets are also broken on the releases, it should be fixed if you build from the latest source.

Use [adc~] and [dac~] for audio input/output. You can use things like [dac~ 3] to output on channel 3 if you need to use more channels. Automation is received with [receive param1], where 1 is to be replaced with the parameter number.

@timothyschoen said:

Thanks! You can set up your own keyboard shortcuts in the settings menu, that might help!

Will do!

Unfortunately there's no way to sync to DAW tempo currently, but I'm planning to add that very soon, as it's obviously needed.

Presets are also broken on the releases, it should be fixed if you build from the latest source.

In a perfect universe, loading the plugin would load also the last patch used. So that you can save your session in your DAW and when reopening you have PlugData ready to go.

Use [adc~] and [dac~] for audio input/output. You can use things like [dac~ 3] to output on channel 3 if you need to use more channels.

Of course! Make sense!

Automation is received with [receive param1], where 1 is to be replaced with the parameter number.

Thanks!

New version out now with support for externals in the standalone. Also, vanilla pd patches should look much better now.

New version is out with many new features and fixes, including a light mode to improve pd compatibility, relative grid, and the latest version of ELSE.

@timothyschoen Thanks for the great work! I tried it with Bitwig 3.2.8 on Windows 10, opened a patch and heard sound.

Some observations:

Selecting help from the right-click menu worked on some objects, but not others. For example, list and netreceive showed the help file, but metro and phasor~ gave message "Couldn't find help file."

Arrays were retained in my opened patch, but editing the values with the mouse was inconsistent, sometimes values would move to the cursor position and then jump back to their previous position. One array showed the dots for values and the other showed nothing but seemed to have correct values being played. Names of the arrays weren't shown, and I couldn't find a way to edit the array properties.

I probably shouldn't expect to receive OSC data from my Android phone, but I tried sending a "listen 8000" message to netreceive and got the error "netreceive: listen failed: The operation completed successfully."

I find this an exciting project and hope it continues to develop.

@plusch Thanks for trying it out! I'll look into the help files problem, I've heard that ELSE help files are also not being found. I'm aware of the array problem as well. I hadn't tried OSC yet, good to know that it's broken, I'll check it out!

There have been many interesting developments recently:

Document browser for opening patches and helpfiles:

Deken support:

Control automation from PlugData, with a button to create the receive object for you:

Object argument suggestion:

Hover messages for inlets/outlets:

v0.5.1 is out now with all the features shown above!

Truly awesome project @timothyschoen !
I installed the previous version last week and had an overall good experience with basic patches, with some minor issues that hopefully I find time to post to the tracker in github.

In any case, thanks so much for doing this! Among the previous attempts to make alternative GUIs for Pd, yours stands out.
I was almost moved when I run it on my laptop after using Pd for 20 years, this is something to behold eheheh

While for long-time users like me it may be tricky to completely switch from Pd-Vanilla to a new GUI, I think the kind of work you are doing will be very helpful to Pd in the long run, especially in helping beginners not to feel intimidated by the trademark, stern GUI of Pd and instead enjoy its community, potentials and quirks
And I can think of several use cases where a user who normally works in Pd-Vanilla would find useful to have the possibility to transfer patches to PlugData: like, creating easily readable patches and plugins for third party use, or artwork packages ready for exhibitions, etc... exciting.

I am curious about the strong resemblance to Max; is it something planned for a particular reason or it was merely used as a quick reference?
It would be even nicer to have a GUI that is unique to Pd, but that's just an aesthetic point lol Nothing to take away from your work!

@MarcoDonnarumma Thanks! I did take some inspiration from Max, it was kind of an obvious inspiration to use. Whenever I wasn't sure about GUI behaviour I'd see what Pd does and what Max does, and pick what I like best. In some cases I went for something different, like the sidebar that tries to show the correct panel without having to click anything. A thing that comes from pd is that objects stick to your cursor when created from a menu. It might be nice to create a more unique/pd-like look, but at the same time I'm quite satisfied with most of the UI right now.

Another reason to take inspiration from Max is that the Max user base is big, and not all of them want to use Ableton

@timothyschoen I see, thanks for the explanation of the process, it makes sense.
Look forward to dive more into PlugData.

@plusch Array component has some properties and works much better now!!