Hi!

Could anyone tell me how to get the cyclone library working again on PD Vanilla/Windows 10? I've been using the Vanilla version happily with cyclone working for months now - yet suddenly today the cyclone library stopped loading. When I first started with Vanilla, I installed the library simply through 'find externals' and it was up and running, but now it keeps saying that "no writeable directory found". I mean...what on earth could have happened between last night and now?

Thanks for any help! I've searched through previous posts here on the same topic but none of the solutions seems very clear to me (I'm not too versed with the technical side of PD yet).

@ilpoj It seems likely that either you have deleted a folder that Pd expects to be able to write to, or permissions to write have been changed, maybe by an update?
David.

@whale-av Hi, thanks David, but no I haven't deleted any folders since my last successful PD session last night, and I still have my administrator rights re other programs. I've also tried using things like [declare] to import the library manually but no success. I'm rather perplexed by this, I've been using the extended version for years without any problems (though running on XP)...I suspect the issue is with the current Windows, not PD.

@ilpoj Yes, I was not explicit enough....... any Windows updates over-night? Someone metioned the same message, and said they had solved the problem, but unfortunately not how!........https://forum.pdpatchrepo.info/topic/10815/having-problem-in-downloadig-comport
The only file that will send that message is "pd_deken.tcl"

It seems that it installs automatically, or asks the user for a directory if the preferred is not found....... but you are not trying to install......
Or are you trying to re-install. Usually the files are written to the directory as read only. If you have a corruption in the Cyclone library and you are trying to overwrite it with Deken it will likely fail with that message...... so you might need to delete the files or change the attributes before re-installing.

David.

    if { "$installdir" == "" } {
        ## search the default paths
        set installdir [ ::deken::get_writable_dir $::sys_staticpath ]
    }
    if { "$installdir" == "" } {
        ## ask the user (and remember the decision)
        ::deken::prompt_installdir
        set installdir [ ::deken::get_writable_dir [list $::deken::installpath ] ]
    }
    if { "$installdir" == "" } {
        #::deken::clearpost
        ::deken::post "No writeable directory found in:" warn
        foreach p $::sys_staticpath { ::deken::post "\t- $p" warn }
        ::deken::post "Cannot download/install libraries!" warn
        return
    }```

@whale-av Yes there was a Windows update actually. I just wonder how that could have caused this...

Yes I tried to reinstall just to see if that could fix the problem. I deleted the library now and changed the attributes, yet the same error message appears when trying to reinstall.

The only way I can get the library loaded is by having it installed in the same folder as my current project, then manually specifying the path in the preferences each time I open pd (I can't understand why it can't save these startup settings, would make life easier). When the library was inside the pd extras folder, if I first opened any patch there, then all my own subsequent patches would load the library normally. But certainly not the practical way to go.

@ilpoj Ah....... your startup settings should be permanent....... so another problem, or maybe the same one? I have many different versions of Vanilla just sitting in folders on my desktop, and when I save startup preferences in one they magically pop up in the others. The only way to change them for only one "Pd" is to add flags to shortcuts, or use batch files.
The opposite problem to yours.
I have just started a search by contents to try to find the file and it's location, but I am using Windows7. I bought a bunch of licenses when windows 10 was revealed.
It will take a few hours.
David.

@whale-av Thanks, David!

Great to hear that the startup settings should be permanent. My Vanilla has always been like this, and I recall some previous versions of extended didn't actually save those, that's why I thought it was the norm. (well curiously, now it does remember my audio settings, before I had to select my external audio card each time... I try not to get 'paranoid' but it's behaving in mysterious ways today indeed).

I thought about installing the pd again, but I read someone had already tried that without any success. Let's see...

not on windows myself, but from reading the forum, i think pd windows stores this kind of information (install dir) in the registry. reinstalling pd would be my first guess to solve this, but it's just a guess...

I've had multiple problems with Vanilla garbling the startup settings on Windows. It's been reported to the devs before, but the problem is difficult to reproduce and so hasn't been taken up yet.

@LiamG @ilpoj
As I suspected, the startup preferences are stored in the registry.
It is likely that windows 10, pursuing the same lockdown techniques as OSX, is not allowing Pd to write to the registry. Google might get you further than this forum.
Everything..... paths, startup options, libraries to be loaded, audio and midi options are stored there.
If you cannot load libraries, or save your settings then that is because you cannot write to the registry.... it's part of the same problem.
I can post my settings that you could paste into your registry (and then modify) if you wish.... obviously at your own risk!........ but first.....

You can right-click the folders in the registry and change permissions.... which should be a zero risk.
Open Regedit and find the key folders listed below and check their permissions.....
You might need to open regedit with admin permissions.
You could also try opening Pd with admin permissions and trying to install cyclone and set paths, but I think it is wish85.exe that accesses the registry.

Vanilla and Extended preferences are stored separately in the following locations (Windows 7)....

HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\VirtualStore\MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Wow6432Node\Pd
HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\VirtualStore\MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Wow6432Node\Pd-extended
HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Classes\VirtualStore\MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Wow6432Node\Pd
HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Classes\VirtualStore\MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Wow6432Node\Pd-extended

This one twice...... probably last known good, and?
HKEY_USERS..."long string" ... Software\Classes\VirtualStore\MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Wow6432Node\Pd(and Pd-extended)
The "long string" will be different to mine on your machine.

@LiamG The garbled paths can be corrected and saved again....... which usually solves the problem.
That seems to be particular to Vanilla.
David.

@whale-av Thanks for looking these up! I went through all of them and I have full control of everything.

I removed the pd and installed it again, and this time it let me install the cyclone library (through 'find externals') into the pd/extra folder as I did the first time. But the problem still persists: it doesn't load the library, and it doesn't remember the startup settings... and I've checked that I have a full control of all pd folders, both as local user and administrator.

Btw. when you specify a library to be loaded in the preferences > startup dialog, is it enough to just write the name of the library or do you have to insert the full path?

@ilpoj preferences > startup is only for libraries, which are single files containing all the objects, like Gem and maybe zexy (depends on os).

cyclone is not a library file but a collection of pd objects, so to load them on startup, the path c://.../extra/cyclone has to be put in preferences > path, not in startup.

@ingox ah ok, well I've done that too but it doesn't save it. hmm...

@ilpoj a possible workaround could be to create a link to pd.exe, open properties and change link target "pd.exe" to "pd.exe -path c://.../extra/cyclone". Not the solution, but might work...

@ilpoj also, if the cyclone directory is in extra/, you should be able to create objects like this: [cyclone/counter]
Does this work?

@ilpoj Full path I think unless they are in an expected path, like "extra".
Are the libraries listed in the registry files? And the search paths?...... there should be a key for every one of your settings.
Is maybe Pd writing, but not reading for some reason?
It would be great to get to the bottom of this. Many have had problems.
David.

@ingox Yes, this works! And if I insert the [cyclone/...] in all of the cyclone objects, they all load perfectly. Thanks! This seems to be the solution at least for now, just to get things working.

@whale-av Yes they are, in all of the registry locations. Like 'loadlib1' assigned to cyclone and 'path1' to the correct path extra/cyclone.

@ilpoj said:

'loadlib1' assigned to cyclone

This seems wrong to me, just guessing. Have you deleted all entries in preferences > startup? Any error messages on startup?

@ingox That's the thing, it doesn't show anything in preferences > startup (just blank fields) even if it had saved my entries, which I have no way of knowing.

The only error message on startup I get is "WARNING: Font family 'DejaVu Sans Mono' not found, using default (courier)".

@ilpoj sorry forgot about that...
have you installed the newest version?