here I found this page https://forum.pdpatchrepo.info/topic/13087/abstractions-as-creation-arguments-things-i-wish-i-knew-before

I added a bit for extra explaination after looking quickly

mine says divde by zero detected.

because I dont understand expr really, I only do everything without them. which is the same thing. probably - it just looks different. If you write out all of them in english Id try and do it regular and maybe learn it at the same time. write it up and ill try it. otherwise your file is missing "output" object I dont know what library it is. it means dac~ ?

this has a bunch of stuff it uses an older version of pd sometimes but you can work around it , they changed a couple object names.
http://pd-tutorial.com/
http://pd-tutorial.com/english/ch03s07.html

this is how you convert the other one, I dont really use symbol lists yet. so I looked it up on the help page for pack object.
abcd_rollover.pd

here I made an odometer thing
mod4_rollover1.pd

aaaa aaab aaac aaad aaba aabb aabc aabd aaca aacb aacc aacd

the ones place goes through "a,b c d" over and over and then the tens place changes to b when you hit "a" again. and then when the ones place changes to a "a" third time the tens place changes to "c" etc etc.

if you have a four number set. you would end up with 4x4x4x4 lists right?
so it looks like 0-9999 except that 0-9 is actually a 4 number set instead of a 10 number set. so you count upward and use the numbers as symbols but you only use 4 before rolling over. that might work.

if you want to turn the knobs . its not very complicated probably. you can send it stuff with like two or three object boxes without doing very much work.

you can set it up as you work. you have to use message boxes with loadbangs. and have it save your array etc. each position where you need a saved number you need to get it prepared to save . it doesnt really have a full save system.

look at "make note" you connect makenote to noteout
. also, note out doesnt send to note in.

this is the newest best one
https://patchstorage.com/pd-gem-joystick-system-hid-library-direction-stabilizer/

this is a first try at getting the aim to stay pointed if you release the joystick

hid_tank1.pd

https://patchstorage.com/author/will-blackhurst/

@willblackhurst " snaphot " never makes any sense to anybody trying to get an accurate number. because there isnt really a number to look at somehow. so whats going on between an array list - and snapshot, why doesnt it just use the array numbers? or give you exact numbers at exact times etc etc.

I heard you wouldnt need tilda then . because all you would do is read the numbers as usual. and that its because your computer was never fast enough to do it so theyve put a ramming mechanism that just shoves the array through at a constant rate.

how do they work? I dont really know.

@willblackhurst tilda is like a wave on top thats from somewhere in your computer/voltage. so it needs a matching system with the tilda voltage syncronized I guess.

so if you print it out , it doesnt make a smooth list of numbers? if youre using line tilda~
it needs to be multiplied with a tilda multiplier ~ Ive seen that I can hook a regular multiply into my volume fader line for scaling the output and then I get a slight distortion. so then I switched to multiply tilda and its better. otherwise you should do the grain number. and test different combinations .

I sorted out "hid"/object so it might work easier now I havnt seen it working before.
this was with a xbox/ looking controler. I got for 10 bucks.
https://patchstorage.com/hidi-midi-joystick-cannon-game-pd-vanilla-gem-pmpd-hid/