Higher order filter in PD extended
@kyro By non-linear I was referring to things like [pow~] getting stuck in the feedback loop, not a correct terminology but one I fall back on with synths because it was a common term in the synth diy community 20 years ago to refer to anything that is not the normal distortion/filtering type stuff in a filters feedback loop.
@manuels The magic of the moog (as in minimoog) is primarily in the output amp which affects the entire filter and is why the ARP version sounds so different, they 'fixed' it and lost the characteristic flavor of the mini's filter. The output amp on the mini's filter does not have anywhere high enough of an impedance to deal with the ladder which drags down frequency response and distorts things, feedback loop comes off output amp so nothing in the filter is untouched by the output amps flaws and it is more the heart of the filter than the ladder. Later Moog ladders are closer to the ARP version, output amp has a high enough impedance and we loose most of the mini's character but we get a decent response in the upper registers in trade.
Most of the classic VCFs are just cascaded 6db filters with a feedback loop for resonance and is my standard, the various 'proper' filters created in the digital world are lacking in many ways to my ears. The cascaded nature of many circuits in the analog world is part of what the digital world is missing, in a 4 pole filter that means we at least have input amp, 4 filter stages, output stage and feedback each giving their own distrotion and frequency characteristic. The filter stages we try and balance and get them to cancel out any quirks to work together but they still have an individual character and input, output and feedback have a very strong character which gives us a rather dynamic result when everything is combined.
And since analog feedback is basically delayless (which in digital land is of course impossibe)
Check my thread on feedback which actually came about because of trying to get a decent filter executed in pd, getting closer.
converting arduino sketches to run in Pd for Bela
@Coalman
To give you even more options:
If you want to patch everything in PD but no hardware change, you could connect an old laptop, or Bela (Beagle Board) or Pi and Arduino via USB (as virtual serial port) and use Firmata or PDuino (available in Deken) to access Arduino's GPIOs from PD.
Not sure if this is the case for the async PWM. (But you could add that function as exception on the Arduino side with input from serial.)
What speed is the PWM? Higher than audio Niquist (probably yes)?
Else you could just do PWM in PD.
Most, if not all popular (micro)controllers provide asynchronous PWM-pins today. Read the datasheets.
Did you already search your answers?
https://forum.bela.io/d/1009-basic-pwm-question/
https://forum.pdpatchrepo.info/topic/12112/raspberry-pi-gpio-and-puredata-does-it-work/
https://github.com/owenosborn/rpi_gpio
There should be many examples for, PD <-> GPIOs on Bela, as this is what it's all about.
reason for this inefficiency is that my knowledge is fairly limited on these platforms.
Maybe decide for one board (or an old laptop with comport) for all projects, and grow with it.
converting arduino sketches to run in Pd for Bela
hello! this question intersects with Pd even if it is not about Pd specifically...
I currently have several (installation) pieces in which the sound is run from Pd and then I have motors or sensors being run off other things.
This means that in one case I am using a raspberry pi for the Pd part and an Arduino mega for the motor part
In another case I have Pd running on a Bela/BBB and then an Arduino doing the motor stuff.
The reason for this inefficiency is that my knowledge is fairly limited on these platforms. However, it is annoying to have to use the extra gear when I don't have to. Especially because I know that both the raspberry and the Bela have pins that could be used in place of the arduino for this purpose. Since the Bela is a simpler case and the pins can be addressed directly from Pure Data, I will ask about that and leave the Raspberry behind for now (as I think I would end up running Pd AND Arduino on that board anyway, whereas with Bela, one can easily address the pins from inside Pd without any other programs or libraries).
My question is this: does anyone know how the standard mappings of pins Analog/Digital/and PWM pins on the Arduino lines up on the Bela? Does the Bela have have PWM pins like, for example pins 8,9, 10,11 on Arduino Mega or Dueminanove? And if so, what is the best way to address them from Pure Data? Basically, I'd like to convert my already very simple Arduino sketches over to Pd, so that both motors and Audio can run from the same patch.
I know this isn't specifically a Pd issue but I have asked a related question on the Bela forum but didn't get an answer so I hoped someone might know or be able to suggest a resource over here...
I have traversed the Bela documentation already of course....and will continue with that meanwhile.
Jorge
warble tones considered harmful?
Sounds BS to me. DC would damage speakers but you can't detect DC by ear (for obvious reasons).
Interestingly, though, FM easily suffers from DC while phase modulation seems not to, at least for ratio >= 1.
hjh
Copy larger array (1mb) to smaller array (64kb) with visual definable startpoint?
Pd prints floating point numbers with 6 decimal digits only, but it may be accurate below that (or it might not be).
In this specific case, 1048580 in fact requires only 6 decimal digits of precision! 1.04858 * 10^6 happens to be exact. So the number did come out right.
1048580 by my calculation needs 21 bits. In 32 bit floating point, the mantissa has 24 bits of precision (23 encoded bits + 1 implicit bit). So 1048581 and 1048579 should also be precise internally, though they will not print the 1s digit.
hjh
Karplus-Strong alternative help
I found this reddit post regarding an alternative to the karplus-strong algorithm to generate string sounds. But the snippet provided is in javascript. I tried implementing it in pd but am having a tough time transferring all the JS idioms into pd. Kindly help. Also, please skip the suggestion of using [expr].
Math detail problem of numbers larger than six or so decimals
@raynovich I agree with your larger point. I don't understand why there isn't more interest in double precision floats. Single precision floating point only gives you so many digits--I think just one or two digits past where Pd is truncating. You can get control of those digits using ugly tricks like this:
The backslash-escaped space before the pi digits stops Pd from truncating it.
Cannot use any digital outputs except 0-7 on Teensy 4.1 with StandardFirmata and Pduino
after further testing.... pins 8-13 also work fine as digital outs. pins 28-37 are the problem pins. they work as digital inputs without issue, but do not work as digital outs. I've also tried it with a second teensy to rule out a bad board... same problem
UGH
Large number representation in pd
@60hz double precision would solve the bit-depth issue, but the textual representation of numbers (floats) would also have to be changed to add precision. (I haven't checked if pd-double does this or not.. katja's page makes it seem like it does though)
here is her description from https://www.katjaas.nl/doubleprecision/doubleprecision.html :
You have probably noticed that single precision floats are represented in Pd with a maximum of 6 significant digits. This is done to hide inconsistencies like 33 * 0.3 = 9.900001, which happens when 7 decimal digits are shown. The limitation to 6 significant digits is however very annoying when we want to type or see large integers, like indexes of long audio buffers.
In calculations, Pd can use all integers from 0 to 2^24 = 16,777,216, over 16 million. Numbers with up to 8 decimal digits. But in the GUI, 1 million is shown in scientific notation as 1e+06. This scientific notation also uses a maximum of 6 significant digits. Therefore, the next representable number is 1.00001e+06, that is 1 million and 10. See below how the result of 2^20 is rounded in the GUI, as an example. The fact that numbers are also stored with patches this way, makes things worse. At 44100 Hz samplerate, one million samples is about 23 seconds - not at all that much. Longer audio buffers are allowed, but handling them in the GUI becomes tricky.
Can't install purr-data on Manjaro
Hey, I'm trying to get purr-data to work on my fresh Manjaro XFCE install, but it does not work. Any help is greatly appreciated!
$ yay purr-data
7 aur/purrdata-faust 0.18-1 (+0 0.00)
Run Faust signal processors in Pd, Purr-Data version
6 aur/purrdata-pure 0.26-1 (+0 0.00)
Loader plugin for the Pure programming language, Purr-Data version
5 aur/purrdata-lv2plugin-git 25.e00f302-1 (+0 0.00)
LV2 plugin host for Pd, Purr-Data version
4 aur/purrdata-mdnsbrowser-git 8.88d2b0c-1 (+0 0.00)
Zeroconf service advertising and discovery for Pd, Purr-Data version
3 aur/purrdata-touchosc-git 44.443c793-1 (+0 0.00)
A TouchOSC MIDI bridge for Pd, Purr-Data version
2 aur/purr-data-git 2.12.0.r4366.6d94e10b-1 (+2 0.00)
Jonathan Wilkes' nw.js variant of Pd-L2Ork (git version)
1 aur/purr-data 2.12.0.r4346.aeb24d89-1 (+6 0.03) (Out-of-date: 2021-06-17)
Jonathan Wilkes' nw.js variant of Pd-L2Ork (git version)
==> Packages to install (eg: 1 2 3, 1-3 or ^4)
==> 2
:: There are 2 providers available for gconf:
:: Repository AUR
1) gconf 2) gconf-gtk2
Enter a number (default=1): ==>
:: Checking for conflicts...
:: Checking for inner conflicts...
[Aur:2] gconf-3.2.6+11+g07808097-10 purr-data-git-2.12.0.r4366.6d94e10b-1
2 gconf (Build Files Exist)
1 purr-data-git
==> Packages to cleanBuild?
==> [N]one [A]ll [Ab]ort [I]nstalled [No]tInstalled or (1 2 3, 1-3, ^4)
==> a
:: Deleting (1/1): /home/olav/.cache/yay/gconf
:: (1/2) Downloaded PKGBUILD: gconf
:: (2/2) Downloaded PKGBUILD: purr-data-git
2 gconf (Build Files Exist)
1 purr-data-git (Build Files Exist)
==> Diffs to show?
==> [N]one [A]ll [Ab]ort [I]nstalled [No]tInstalled or (1 2 3, 1-3, ^4)
==>
:: (1/2) Parsing SRCINFO: gconf
:: (2/2) Parsing SRCINFO: purr-data-git
==> Making package: gconf 3.2.6+11+g07808097-10 (Wed 09 Feb 2022 10:23:23 PM CET)
==> Retrieving sources...
-> Cloning gconf git repo...
Cloning into bare repository '/home/olav/.cache/yay/gconf/gconf'...
==> Making package: purr-data-git 2.12.0.r4366.6d94e10b-1 (Wed 09 Feb 2022 10:23:23 PM CET)
==> Retrieving sources...
-> Cloning purr-data-git git repo...
Cloning into bare repository '/home/olav/.cache/yay/purr-data-git/purr-data-git'...
remote: Enumerating objects: 21531, done.
remote: Enumerating objects: 63399, done.
remote: Counting objects: 100% (1852/1852), done.
remote: Compressing objects: 100% (641/641), done.
remote: Total 21531 (delta 0), reused 0 (delta 0), pack-reused 21531
Receiving objects: 100% (21531/21531), 10.88 MiB | 9.46 MiB/s, done.
Resolving deltas: 100% (17681/17681), done.1 KiB | 704.00 KiB/s
-> Found 01_xml-gettext-domain.patch388.01 KiB | 704.00 KiB/s
-> Found gconf-reload.patch
-> Found gconf-merge-schema
-> Found gconfpkg
-> Found gconf-install.hook
-> Found gconf-remove.hook
==> Validating source files with sha256sums...
gconf ... Skipped
01_xml-gettext-domain.patch ... Passed
gconf-reload.patch ... Passed
gconf-merge-schema ... Passed
gconfpkg ... Passed
gconf-install.hook ... Passed
gconf-remove.hook ... Passed
remote: Total 63399 (delta 1106), reused 1786 (delta 1052), pack-reused 61547
Receiving objects: 100% (63399/63399), 177.19 MiB | 5.71 MiB/s, done.
Resolving deltas: 100% (33721/33721), done.
-> Downloading nwjs-sdk-v0.24.4-linux-x64.tar.gz...
% Total % Received % Xferd Average Speed Time Time Time Current
Dload Upload Total Spent Left Speed
100 86.7M 100 86.7M 0 0 3966k 0 0:00:22 0:00:22 --:--:-- 8404k
==> Validating source files with md5sums...
purr-data-git ... Skipped
==> Validating source_x86_64 files with md5sums...
nwjs-sdk-v0.24.4-linux-x64.tar.gz ... Passed
==> Making package: gconf 3.2.6+11+g07808097-10 (Wed 09 Feb 2022 10:24:19 PM CET)
==> Checking runtime dependencies...
==> Checking buildtime dependencies...
==> Retrieving sources...
-> Updating gconf git repo...
Fetching origin
-> Found 01_xml-gettext-domain.patch
-> Found gconf-reload.patch
-> Found gconf-merge-schema
-> Found gconfpkg
-> Found gconf-install.hook
-> Found gconf-remove.hook
==> Validating source files with sha256sums...
gconf ... Skipped
01_xml-gettext-domain.patch ... Passed
gconf-reload.patch ... Passed
gconf-merge-schema ... Passed
gconfpkg ... Passed
gconf-install.hook ... Passed
gconf-remove.hook ... Passed
==> Removing existing $srcdir/ directory...
==> Extracting sources...
-> Creating working copy of gconf git repo...
Cloning into 'gconf'...
done.
Switched to a new branch 'makepkg'
==> Starting prepare()...
/home/olav/.cache/yay/gconf/PKGBUILD: line 30: patch: command not found
==> ERROR: A failure occurred in prepare().
Aborting...
-> error making: gconf
And
yay purr-data
7 aur/purrdata-faust 0.18-1 (+0 0.00)
Run Faust signal processors in Pd, Purr-Data version
6 aur/purrdata-pure 0.26-1 (+0 0.00)
Loader plugin for the Pure programming language, Purr-Data version
5 aur/purrdata-lv2plugin-git 25.e00f302-1 (+0 0.00)
LV2 plugin host for Pd, Purr-Data version
4 aur/purrdata-mdnsbrowser-git 8.88d2b0c-1 (+0 0.00)
Zeroconf service advertising and discovery for Pd, Purr-Data version
3 aur/purrdata-touchosc-git 44.443c793-1 (+0 0.00)
A TouchOSC MIDI bridge for Pd, Purr-Data version
2 aur/purr-data-git 2.12.0.r4366.6d94e10b-1 (+2 0.00)
Jonathan Wilkes' nw.js variant of Pd-L2Ork (git version)
1 aur/purr-data 2.12.0.r4346.aeb24d89-1 (+6 0.03) (Out-of-date: 2021-06-17)
Jonathan Wilkes' nw.js variant of Pd-L2Ork (git version)
==> Packages to install (eg: 1 2 3, 1-3 or ^4)
==> 2
:: There are 2 providers available for gconf:
:: Repository AUR
1) gconf 2) gconf-gtk2
Enter a number (default=1): ==>
:: Checking for conflicts...
:: Checking for inner conflicts...
[Aur:2] gconf-3.2.6+11+g07808097-10 purr-data-git-2.12.0.r4366.6d94e10b-1
2 gconf (Build Files Exist)
1 purr-data-git
==> Packages to cleanBuild?
==> [N]one [A]ll [Ab]ort [I]nstalled [No]tInstalled or (1 2 3, 1-3, ^4)
==> a
:: Deleting (1/1): /home/olav/.cache/yay/gconf
:: (1/2) Downloaded PKGBUILD: gconf
:: (2/2) Downloaded PKGBUILD: purr-data-git
2 gconf (Build Files Exist)
1 purr-data-git (Build Files Exist)
==> Diffs to show?
==> [N]one [A]ll [Ab]ort [I]nstalled [No]tInstalled or (1 2 3, 1-3, ^4)
==>
:: (1/2) Parsing SRCINFO: gconf
:: (2/2) Parsing SRCINFO: purr-data-git
==> Making package: gconf 3.2.6+11+g07808097-10 (Wed 09 Feb 2022 10:23:23 PM CET)
==> Retrieving sources...
-> Cloning gconf git repo...
Cloning into bare repository '/home/olav/.cache/yay/gconf/gconf'...
==> Making package: purr-data-git 2.12.0.r4366.6d94e10b-1 (Wed 09 Feb 2022 10:23:23 PM CET)
==> Retrieving sources...
-> Cloning purr-data-git git repo...
Cloning into bare repository '/home/olav/.cache/yay/purr-data-git/purr-data-git'...
remote: Enumerating objects: 21531, done.
remote: Enumerating objects: 63399, done.
remote: Counting objects: 100% (1852/1852), done.
remote: Compressing objects: 100% (641/641), done.
remote: Total 21531 (delta 0), reused 0 (delta 0), pack-reused 21531
Receiving objects: 100% (21531/21531), 10.88 MiB | 9.46 MiB/s, done.
Resolving deltas: 100% (17681/17681), done.1 KiB | 704.00 KiB/s
-> Found 01_xml-gettext-domain.patch388.01 KiB | 704.00 KiB/s
-> Found gconf-reload.patch
-> Found gconf-merge-schema
-> Found gconfpkg
-> Found gconf-install.hook
-> Found gconf-remove.hook
==> Validating source files with sha256sums...
gconf ... Skipped
01_xml-gettext-domain.patch ... Passed
gconf-reload.patch ... Passed
gconf-merge-schema ... Passed
gconfpkg ... Passed
gconf-install.hook ... Passed
gconf-remove.hook ... Passed
remote: Total 63399 (delta 1106), reused 1786 (delta 1052), pack-reused 61547
Receiving objects: 100% (63399/63399), 177.19 MiB | 5.71 MiB/s, done.
Resolving deltas: 100% (33721/33721), done.
-> Downloading nwjs-sdk-v0.24.4-linux-x64.tar.gz...
% Total % Received % Xferd Average Speed Time Time Time Current
Dload Upload Total Spent Left Speed
100 86.7M 100 86.7M 0 0 3966k 0 0:00:22 0:00:22 --:--:-- 8404k
==> Validating source files with md5sums...
purr-data-git ... Skipped
==> Validating source_x86_64 files with md5sums...
nwjs-sdk-v0.24.4-linux-x64.tar.gz ... Passed
==> Making package: gconf 3.2.6+11+g07808097-10 (Wed 09 Feb 2022 10:24:19 PM CET)
==> Checking runtime dependencies...
==> Checking buildtime dependencies...
==> Retrieving sources...
-> Updating gconf git repo...
Fetching origin
-> Found 01_xml-gettext-domain.patch
-> Found gconf-reload.patch
-> Found gconf-merge-schema
-> Found gconfpkg
-> Found gconf-install.hook
-> Found gconf-remove.hook
==> Validating source files with sha256sums...
gconf ... Skipped
01_xml-gettext-domain.patch ... Passed
gconf-reload.patch ... Passed
gconf-merge-schema ... Passed
gconfpkg ... Passed
gconf-install.hook ... Passed
gconf-remove.hook ... Passed
==> Removing existing $srcdir/ directory...
==> Extracting sources...
-> Creating working copy of gconf git repo...
Cloning into 'gconf'...
done.
Switched to a new branch 'makepkg'
==> Starting prepare()...
/home/olav/.cache/yay/gconf/PKGBUILD: line 30: patch: command not found
==> ERROR: A failure occurred in prepare().
Aborting...
-> error making: gconf
[olav@AMD-Computer ~]$ yay purr-data
7 aur/purrdata-faust 0.18-1 (+0 0.00)
Run Faust signal processors in Pd, Purr-Data version
6 aur/purrdata-pure 0.26-1 (+0 0.00)
Loader plugin for the Pure programming language, Purr-Data version
5 aur/purrdata-lv2plugin-git 25.e00f302-1 (+0 0.00)
LV2 plugin host for Pd, Purr-Data version
4 aur/purrdata-mdnsbrowser-git 8.88d2b0c-1 (+0 0.00)
Zeroconf service advertising and discovery for Pd, Purr-Data version
3 aur/purrdata-touchosc-git 44.443c793-1 (+0 0.00)
A TouchOSC MIDI bridge for Pd, Purr-Data version
2 aur/purr-data-git 2.12.0.r4366.6d94e10b-1 (+2 0.00)
Jonathan Wilkes' nw.js variant of Pd-L2Ork (git version)
1 aur/purr-data 2.12.0.r4346.aeb24d89-1 (+6 0.03) (Out-of-date: 2021-06-17)
Jonathan Wilkes' nw.js variant of Pd-L2Ork (git version)
==> Packages to install (eg: 1 2 3, 1-3 or ^4)
==> 2
:: There are 2 providers available for gconf:
:: Repository AUR
1) gconf 2) gconf-gtk2
Enter a number (default=1): ==> 2
:: Checking for conflicts...
:: Checking for inner conflicts...
[Aur:2] gconf-gtk2-3.2.6-5 purr-data-git-2.12.0.r4366.6d94e10b-1
2 gconf-gtk2 (Build Files Exist)
1 purr-data-git (Build Files Exist)
==> Packages to cleanBuild?
==> [N]one [A]ll [Ab]ort [I]nstalled [No]tInstalled or (1 2 3, 1-3, ^4)
==> a
:: Deleting (1/2): /home/olav/.cache/yay/gconf-gtk2
:: Deleting (2/2): /home/olav/.cache/yay/purr-data-git
:: (1/2) Downloaded PKGBUILD: purr-data-git
:: (2/2) Downloaded PKGBUILD: gconf-gtk2
2 gconf-gtk2 (Build Files Exist)
1 purr-data-git (Build Files Exist)
==> Diffs to show?
==> [N]one [A]ll [Ab]ort [I]nstalled [No]tInstalled or (1 2 3, 1-3, ^4)
==>
:: (1/2) Parsing SRCINFO: gconf-gtk2
:: (2/2) Parsing SRCINFO: purr-data-git
==> Making package: purr-data-git 2.12.0.r4366.6d94e10b-1 (Wed 09 Feb 2022 10:40:58 PM CET)
==> Retrieving sources...
==> Making package: gconf-gtk2 3.2.6-5 (Wed 09 Feb 2022 10:40:58 PM CET)
==> Retrieving sources...
-> Cloning purr-data-git git repo...
Cloning into bare repository '/home/olav/.cache/yay/purr-data-git/purr-data-git'...
-> Downloading GConf-3.2.6.tar.xz...
% Total % Received % Xferd Average Speed Time Time Time Current
Dload Upload Total Spent Left Speed
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 --:--:-- --:--:-- --:--:-- 0
100 1523k 100 1523k 0 0 1610k 0 --:--:-- --:--:-- --:--:-- 1610k
-> Found gconf-merge-schema
-> Found gconfpkg
-> Found gconf-reload.patch
-> Found gconf-install.hook
-> Found gconf-remove.hook
-> Found 01_xml-gettext-domain.patch
-> Found dbus-dontspew.patch
-> Found gsettings-data-convert-fix-invalid-schema-path.patch
==> Validating source files with sha256sums...
GConf-3.2.6.tar.xz ... Passed
gconf-merge-schema ... Passed
gconfpkg ... Passed
gconf-reload.patch ... Passed
gconf-install.hook ... Passed
gconf-remove.hook ... Passed
01_xml-gettext-domain.patch ... Passed
dbus-dontspew.patch ... Passed
gsettings-data-convert-fix-invalid-schema-path.patch ... Passed
remote: Enumerating objects: 63399, done.
remote: Counting objects: 100% (1852/1852), done.
remote: Compressing objects: 100% (641/641), done.
remote: Total 63399 (delta 1106), reused 1786 (delta 1052), pack-reused 61547
Receiving objects: 100% (63399/63399), 177.19 MiB | 9.76 MiB/s, done.
Resolving deltas: 100% (33721/33721), done.
-> Downloading nwjs-sdk-v0.24.4-linux-x64.tar.gz...
% Total % Received % Xferd Average Speed Time Time Time Current
Dload Upload Total Spent Left Speed
100 86.7M 100 86.7M 0 0 11.7M 0 0:00:07 0:00:07 --:--:-- 14.4M
==> Validating source files with md5sums...
purr-data-git ... Skipped
==> Validating source_x86_64 files with md5sums...
nwjs-sdk-v0.24.4-linux-x64.tar.gz ... Passed
==> Making package: gconf-gtk2 3.2.6-5 (Wed 09 Feb 2022 10:41:26 PM CET)
==> Checking runtime dependencies...
==> Checking buildtime dependencies...
==> Retrieving sources...
-> Found GConf-3.2.6.tar.xz
-> Found gconf-merge-schema
-> Found gconfpkg
-> Found gconf-reload.patch
-> Found gconf-install.hook
-> Found gconf-remove.hook
-> Found 01_xml-gettext-domain.patch
-> Found dbus-dontspew.patch
-> Found gsettings-data-convert-fix-invalid-schema-path.patch
==> Validating source files with sha256sums...
GConf-3.2.6.tar.xz ... Passed
gconf-merge-schema ... Passed
gconfpkg ... Passed
gconf-reload.patch ... Passed
gconf-install.hook ... Passed
gconf-remove.hook ... Passed
01_xml-gettext-domain.patch ... Passed
dbus-dontspew.patch ... Passed
gsettings-data-convert-fix-invalid-schema-path.patch ... Passed
==> Removing existing $srcdir/ directory...
==> Extracting sources...
-> Extracting GConf-3.2.6.tar.xz with bsdtar
==> Starting prepare()...
/home/olav/.cache/yay/gconf-gtk2/PKGBUILD: line 39: patch: command not found
==> ERROR: A failure occurred in prepare().
Aborting...
-> error making: gconf-gtk2